© LloydI started a Google Doc, in case it would help to work together on this somewhat sometime. It's at https://docs.google.com/document/d/11UOwtMQTVbUh30gJO00Ykxe~.
Below I have your first edit or draft from the forum thread at the bottom, then my edit of that, plus my questions, above your first edit, next I have the 3rd edit here toward the top, plus some questions highlighted in yellow and my proposed addition at the end under the green highlight. In the 4th edit the highlighting is my potential addition to Charles' model.
4th Edit
The Sun is layers of plasma attracted to each other.
The attraction is far more than gravity can explain.
At the surface, the density drops off sharply, as if the plasma is in a sealed container.
No heat source, nuclear or otherwise, creates such containment in free space.
Since the hydrogen and helium in the Sun do not have strong magnetic dipoles, magnetostatics is ruled out.
This leaves electrostatics as the most likely attractive force.
Electrostatics involves opposite charges attracted to each other by the electric force.
This means charge separation must occur.
At relativistic speeds, the magnetic force becomes as powerful as the electric force, and influences charge motion.
If there are charged particles shooting through space, the magnetic field exerts back-pressure on the charged particles, organizing them by the magnetic pinch effect.
The magnetic fields, perpendicular to motion, generated by positive and negative charges moving in the same direction, oppose each other.
This constitutes repelling magnetic pressure between charge streams.
The result is a charge-separated plasma jet.
Positive and negative charge jets form helically twisted pairs of charge streams known as a Birkeland currents.
The same is true for circular plasma jets, as for linear ones.
These circular plasma jets behave like tokamaks.
* If you look at the twisted pair of streams head-on as they're coming toward you in space, you could see the cross-section of each stream as a circle. They look like two circles revolving around each other. The positive stream circle is future core of the star and the negative circle is the future first negative layer that will surround the core.
* In a vast ionized gas cloud there will be little currents forming and these will feed into larger currents, like tributaries of a river. So that's how the positive and negative streams become large enough to form a core. If the current gets too fast, the magnetic fields will pinch and eventually cause the pinched part of the streams to stop briefly, and the momentum of the material approaching the pinch will slam it into the stopped material, making two balls of plasma, one of each charge. The balls attract each other and the negative ball, being lighter, falls onto the positive ball and forms a layer around it. The positive ball continues to spin with less forward momentum than when it was a moving stream, but it has enough rotational velocity to maintain enough magnetic field to prevent the negative charge from penetrating and neutralizing the positive core.
* The trailing streams continue to move forward and fall onto the core in successive layers, until the streams are fairly exhausted and a star has formed.
Based on these principles, we get formation of the core of the Sun or star.
The core rotates as a solid body, at a faster revolution rate than the overlying layers.
If the angular velocity in the core were 3 km/s, magnetic fields 10 orders of magnitude greater than those in electric motors will generate a magnetic pinch effect.
The pinch will accomplish some consolidation of like charges, and separation of opposite charges.
Since the core is positively charged, there will be a negatively charged double-layer above it.
This double-layer will be attracted to the core by the electric force, but repelled from it by the magnetic force.
Many layers may form above the core.
The first visible layer, but one of the last ones formed, would be the radiative zone.3rd Edit
The Sun is layers of plasma attracted to each other.
The attraction is far more than gravity can explain.
At the surface, the density drops off sharply, as if the plasma is in a sealed container.
No heat source, nuclear or otherwise, creates such containment in free space.
Since the hydrogen and helium in the Sun do not have strong magnetic dipoles, magnetostatics is ruled out.
This leaves electrostatics as the most likely attractive force.
Electrostatics involves opposite charges attracted to each other by the electric force.
This means charge separation must occur.
At relativistic speeds, the magnetic force becomes as powerful as the electric force, and influences charge motion.
* Are you sure the initial separated charge streams need to move at relativistic speeds? That's at least about 10% of light speed, or 30,000 km/s. Why is 3 km/s enough to maintain charge separation in the Sun, but not in space? Water in a container and exposed to light maintains charge separation near the container walls.
If there are charged particles shooting through space, the magnetic field exerts back-pressure on the charged particles, organizing them by the magnetic pinch effect.
The magnetic fields, perpendicular to motion, generated by positive and negative charges moving in the same direction, oppose each other.
This constitutes repelling magnetic pressure between charges.
The result is a charge-separated plasma jet.
Positive and negative charge jets form twisted pairs of charge streams known as a Birkeland currents.
The same is true about circular plasma jets, as is about linear ones.
These circular plasma jets behave like tokamaks.
To build a model on these principles, we will start with the core of the Sun.
The core rotates as a solid body, at a faster revolution rate than the overlying layers.
If the angular velocity in the core were 3 km/s, magnetic fields 10 orders of magnitude greater than those in electric motors will generate a magnetic pinch effect.
The pinch will accomplish some consolidation of like charges, and separation of opposite charges.
The core is probably positively charged.
This means that outside of the core, there will be a negatively charged double-layer.
This double-layer will be attracted to the core by the electric force, but repelled from it by the magnetic force.
This layer would be the radiative zone.
* You said recently that the .3 ly diameter filaments in a star-forming region, mentioned in a Thornhill http://holoscience.com article last year, appear to be electrical. I think you meant they suggest charge separated currents. Right?
* Isn't a current with a diameter of the Sun's core all we need? The current is already spinning positive and negative charge. With a little magnetic pinching, won't the charges in the current thicken? And to get such pinching, it just needs to enter a region that causes the current to speed up. Is that right?
* So that's the whole process, isn't it? I mean, once the positive core is formed, the adjacent negative stream will pile onto it. Then you just need some more charge separated currents to supply the remaining outer layers. Hmm?
* And what do you need to maintain the Sun's continuing energy output? It seems that Miles Mathis answered that with his 15% charge field supply of power and 85% fusion supply. ???
* So my idea is to finish the process as follows.
Birkeland current filaments, some known to be 0.3 ly in diameter, contain twisted pairs of opposite charge currents, already rotating around each other, while also moving forward through space.
Where the current pairs speed up, due to lower resistance in a region of space, magnetic pinching causes the currents to thicken behind the pinches.What causes lower resistance to current speed in space?This animation, at the one minute mark, may help explain how a ball of positive plasma forms in space to initiate star formation: http://focusfusion.org/index.php/site/article/dpf_animation/.
As the positive core forms, part of the negative stream forms a layer around the core, because of electrical attraction to it.
Successive layers of each charge build up around each preceding layer, until the supply current reaches a minimum flow rate.
.
2nd Edit + Questions for Next Edit
[T]he Sun is obviously a bunch of plasma that is attracted to itself — far more so than gravity can explain....
At the surface, the density drops off sharply, as if the plasma is inside a sealed container. ...
[And] no heat source (nuclear or otherwise) creates containment in free space.
Since the hydrogen and helium in the Sun do not have strong magnetic dipoles, we can rule out magnetostatics. ...
This leaves electrostatics as the attractive force.
In other words, a charge separation has occurred, and the opposite charges are attracted to each other by the electric force.
- At relativistic speeds, the magnetic force becomes as powerful as the electric force, and can influence the current. ...
[And] if the "current" is charged particles shooting through space, the magnetic field exerts back-pressure on the charged particles, consolidating them in what is known as the magnetic pinch effect. ...
[The magnetic] fields generated by positive and negative charges moving in the same direction oppose each other.
And this, of course, generates magnetic [repulsive] pressure between them. ...
The result is a charge-separated plasma jet. ...
[P]ositive and negative [jets] form a "twisted pair" of charge streams known as a Birkeland current....
If this much is true about linear plasma jets, then it is also true about circular jets. ...
Here it is useful to think of these circular plasma jets as a sort of open-air tokamak.
- To build a model out of these principles, we will start with the core of the Sun.
It is known that the core rotates as a solid body, at a faster revolution rate than the overlying layers. ...
Nominally, we'll say that the angular velocity in the core is 3 km/s.
At such speeds, magnetic fields 10 orders of magnitude greater than those in electric motors will generate a magnetic pinch effect that will accomplish some consolidation of like charges, and separation of opposite charges.
Just guessing, let's say that the core is positively charged.
- This means that outside of the core, there will be a negatively charged double-layer.
This double-layer will be attracted to the core by the electric force, but repelled from it by the magnetic force.
This layer would be the radiative zone. (Etc.)
Questions for 3rd Edit
* Are you sure the initial separated charge streams need to move at relativistic speeds? That's at least about 10% of light speed, or 30,000 km/s. Why is 3 km/s enough to maintain charge separation in the Sun, but not in space?
* Water in a container and exposed to light maintains charge separation near the container walls.
* You said recently that the .3 ly diameter filaments in a star-forming region, mentioned in a Thornhill http://holoscience.com article last year, appear to be electrical. I think you meant they suggest charge separated currents. Right?
* Isn't a current with a diameter of the Sun's core all we need? The current is already spinning positive and negative charge. With a little magnetic pinching, won't the charges in the current thicken? And to get such pinching, it just needs to enter a region that causes the current to speed up. Is that right?
* So that's the whole process, isn't it? I mean, once the positive core is formed, the adjacent negative stream will pile onto it. Then you just need some more charge separated currents to supply the remaining outer layers. Hmm?
* And what do you need to maintain the Sun's continuing energy output? It seems that Miles Mathis answered that with his 15% charge field supply of power and 85% fusion supply. ???
First Edit
The Sun's Density Gradient
http://thunderbolts.info/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=5613#p62022