As far as I know, no one has organised any EU projects for citizen scientists; hence this thread.
Mike H and I briefly discussed one such possible project here, the re-running of Peratt's PIC simulations, and extending them to include star formation. Lloyd has started something similar already - Help Us Explain Crater Formation!
Do you have good ideas about any such projects? What do you think would be needed for such a project to be successful (other than participation by sufficient numbers of citizen scientists)?
Levatio
Re: Possible projects for electric universe citizen scientists
I'd love to participate in an EU project.
Some projects could be small-scale electrical or plasma experiments on High-school or university. Not under the name of EU, but perhaps undercover? As probably most universities won't allow any room for the EU. Perhaps a convention in a hall or outside to make people aware of this theory? Probably the easiest convention would be somewhere outside in a park of some sort. And with some simple made stand showing the different kind of aspects?
Most of you know SETI. Using computers of others, decoding data and such. Perhaps we could try to do a same thing? But something wich is valid and does work?
Hope this is any of use
Nereid
Re: Possible projects for electric universe citizen scientists
Great to see that you're interested, Levatio!
What sort of small-scale electrical or plasma experiment do you have in mind? I'm quite curious because I can't think of any such - that could be done in an average high school or university - that wouldn't already have been done many times.
Based on a post by jjohnson, I thought of a rather simple project - create plasma instability templates and serve up images of galaxies to EUers for them to vote on which (if any) such instabilities seem to be present. Sorta like Galaxy Zoo, only with an EU/plasma focus.
Goldminer
Re: Possible projects for electric universe citizen scientists
Nereid wrote: I thought of a rather simple project - create plasma instability templates and serve up images of galaxies to EUers for them to vote on which (if any) such instabilities seem to be present. Sorta like Galaxy Zoo, only with an EU/plasma focus.
Ah yes! Democratic Science! What an idea! Should we decide beforehand whether to use the demonstratively goofy system of 50% plus one to determine the Group mind? Or how about a 75% majority requirement to elicit less divisiveness? Or even the perfect unanimous vote to totally exclude divisiveness altogether, along with excluding the influence of a facilitator with a hidden agenda? I propose a dictator, financed by the World Bankers appointed by them to make the final decision. Group think, Group think!
Wait a minute, who is the partially hidden guy down in the corner waving his hand. Naw, just one of a kind. Pay no attention.
orrery
Re: Possible projects for electric universe citizen scientists
Citizens do need to get involved at some level. However, there are better ways of doing that then what most seem to be suggesting here.
Here is what we need.
K-12 Science Textbooks University Textbooks
All made with an emphasis on greater Electric Universe scientific understanding. Simple changes in language must also be made, we need to group petition certain language and challenge their usage.
"The Universe was created 14 billion years" "The Universe is 14 billion years old." "Telescopes look back into time when the universe was just 100 million years old."
These are things that NASA does that are scientifically irresponsible. Many of our textbooks continue to have this bent towards a Big Bang Theory. Many public schools teach Creationist Theory alongside the Big Bang. We need to forcefully interject Electric Universe Theory and put it on a sound basis.
So go to your Parent-Teacher Association meeting and demand EU in your textbooks.
Nereid
Re: Possible projects for electric universe citizen scientists
orrery wrote: Here is what we need. K-12 Science Textbooks University Textbooks
All made with an emphasis on greater Electric Universe scientific understanding.
Do you know of any such textbooks orrery?
Goldminer
Re: Possible projects for electric universe citizen scientists
Better yet: Home school your offspring. Generally, "Public Education" provides exactly what 50% of the public demands. Since 50% of the public is below average, (in every way) is it any wonder that you get exactly what you pay for?
orrery
Re: Possible projects for electric universe citizen scientists
Nereid wrote: Do you know of any such textbooks orrery?
Sadly, no.
Goldminer
Re: Possible projects for electric universe citizen scientists
If you want a book dummed down to the 2nd grade level, thankfully there are none. It took me until my freshman year in college before I learned to junk the "text book" and investigate other sources for my education. Of course that drove some of my instructors nuts, because I usually had some comment or question that was not addressed by the "textbook" or the lecturer. The instructors I respected the most, appreciated my attitude. (Well I guess that goes without saying, but there it is anyway.)
Put your children on to this stuff, and see them light up!
Lloyd
Re: Possible projects for electric universe citizen scientists
* The best way I know of for a group to choose a major project is for members of the group to mention their individual goals, and whichever goals are shared by all, or nearly all, become the group goal or goals. * If some motivated members share a goal not shared by less active members, they can form a smaller group and choose that as the common goal. * Some of us have the desire to help the TB team promote EU theory. By promote, I don't mean to persuade people that it's correct. I mean promote realistic and effective study of EU theory to determine scientifically how much of it is correct. * Many members of the TB team and of this forum consider conventional society to be highly biased against studying any theories that oppose media- and establishment-supported pretended science. * M. Scott Peck, a psychologist who in 1972 did a government study of the 1970 My Lai massacre in Vietnam, said in his 1983 book, People of the Lie, that it's difficult for members of large successful groups to imagine that their group is not the best there is, or that it does anything wrong, because success gives them false pride and the illusion of superiority. He said it's easy for large groups to commit wrongful acts, because responsibility is diluted. If confronted about a wrongful act, subordinates who carry out the act tend to claim that their leaders told them to do it, while the leaders tend to say the subordinates misunderstood their orders. He said everyone should be leaders, not followers, because following is immature. In other words each person should be one's own leader. And leaders should help leaders and followers to be better leaders. He said everyone should be amateur scientists [citizen scientists], so they know when science is doing wrong and can help stop it. He predicted that the U.S. would go to war again after Vietnam, because of false pride and failure to acknowledge wrong-doing. And science is used to support such wrong-doing. And technology is used to distance people from the suffering that domineering groups inflict on their "enemies". * Alfred de Grazia is a behavioral scientist who helped write the book, The Velikovsky Affair, in 1967, I think. He and others pointed out in that book that conventional science greatly abused Velikovsky and supported the media in furthering the abuse. The book pointed out the unscientific approach that establishment science adopted. I don't know if behavioral sciences are really scientific, or unbiased, enough themselves to help end unscientific practices in science, but it seems that it will take a major house cleaning before establishment science will ever become true science. * Maybe the "soft" sciences or amateur soft scientists will need to prove to the scientific establishment that it is abusive of scientific method. The approach I'm taking myself is to do this in politics. I hope to show reasonable people in politics that there is abuse of power in politics. That abuse carries over into all parts of society, including science.
orrery
Re: Possible projects for electric universe citizen scientists
Back to the topic at hand. We're discussing projects like Galaxy Zoo and Storm Watch. This would be very interesting. I'd mostly like to see a map of galactic birkeland currents mapped out through a BOINC project like MilkyWay@Home, Einstein@Home or SETI@Home.
orrery
Re: Possible projects for electric universe citizen scientists
Galactic Electric Currents are the key to interstellar travel imo. They are prebuilt stargates or railroads and we need to learn how to exploit them.
MGmirkin
Re: Possible projects for electric universe citizen scientists
Personally, I'd love to see some kind of BOINC-based approach like distributed particle physics simulations electrodynamic + gravitational code to simulate various scenarios, be they proxies for galaxy-scale things or trying to pin down the mechanics of the sun / sun spots.
Perhaps some kind of sky-survey comprehensively comparing quasar positions to galaxy positions in some way that figures out whether Arp's model of ejection and/or Wal's thoughts on the issue might be correct.
For that matter, electrodynamic simulation of Wal's thoughts on quasar ejection from a galactic center plasmoid devoid in electrons thus affecting redshift (granted, one would have to try to simulate his/Sansbury's subatomic, sub-fundamental particle model re: subtrons, neutrinos, light, gravity, aether et al first, which could itself be an interesting 'toy model' BOINC simulation to test the theories on gravitation, et al as a byproduct of electrical interactions at the sub-fundamental particle level). If that test works on some level, then it could move on to things like quasar ejection, orbit stabilization & capture, explaining gravity as a daisy-chaining electric dipole (Van der Waals / London force) effect, etc.
There's lots of things that need better (or any) experiment (simulated or otherwise) if we had the funds and technology at our disposal (and the right folks to code it all correctly to output valid results; GIGO [Garbage In, Garbage Out] & all that).
Best, ~Michael Gmirkin
MGmirkin
Re: Possible projects for electric universe citizen scientists
Not specifically a science-related project per se, but more of a knowledge agglomeration project I've considered for some time (but definitely have no technical expertise to actually accomplish myself) would be a social media collaboration tool for building a kind of web-based knowledgebase of useful links and references. It would be a kind of hybrid system.
Ideally it would be configurable in one of several ways: 1) News Site like Digg (complete with configurable RSS feeds for "new items" in a given category or with a given combination of keywords you define). 2) Directory Site like DMOZ or Yahoo 3) Knowledge repository or cataloging service for tagging and "finding" / researching topics.
Ideally it would be open for everyone to access and use. There would be some kind of public suggestion and tagging system as well as a private fast-track addition & tagging system. There would be solid administrative roles and controls so that the administrator can control the content and make it as broad or as specific as possible for their given topic. There should be some kind of administrative approval system (granular from "everything is automatically added by everyone" to "everyone can suggest but only admins can approve" or "only admins can add content"). The tagging system should be robust and administrable (for instance being able to ban tag words permanently, strip tags, batch add tags, merge, group or otherwise redirect tags like electric/electrical, plasma/plasmas), etc.
I think it could be a pretty cool resource and usable in many different settings. The idea is that it would be a specific form of web site CMS. Currently, I haven't found any CMS that works on all fronts like that out of the box or even with correctly configured extensions. It would be great to have a kind of central repository that one could just keep adding good references and news stories and papers and such to over time, that would then be searchable / browseable (in multiple ways, depending on how you preferred to find things: via directory structure or via tags) and systematically "manageable." I got kind of close with a CMS called Hotaru once a couple of add-ons were installed, but it still just didn't quite work right the way I wanted it to and seemed to not be very customizable without knowing lots of PHP programming tricks and such.
Lloyd
Re: Possible projects for electric universe citizen scientists
TRY THIS * Learn by Doing! * In other words, let's just try some things. * I think something that's productive to collaborate on is making lists. * And a list of Anomalies would be useful. It could contain a second column for links to Solutions or Explanations. * For an example of a list of anomalies, see the table about 2/3 of the way down the page at http://saturniancosmology.org/juergensa.htm. It's called "TABLE 1: Competence of Various Sinuous Rille Theories". The anomalies of lunar rilles are listed on the left. * I suppose such a project could be done here on a new thread. * Okay, I just started an Anomalies List Project at http://thunderbolts.info/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=4180. * If you want to do something useful, please go and add an anomaly to the list.
