Webo said: When I first learned about subduction in geology class at UW[1973], I objected on the same basis as the wooden nail and cannon ball analogy, and the prof [actually a post grad TA] replied that the resistance to subducting crust by the mantle was what drove the crustal heating that fires up the volcanic chains [eg notably the ring of fire]. It made some sense to me then, and the anti-subduction arguments I've heard here and on the expanding earth thread don't overthrow this assertion for me.
* Impossible subduction should not be theorized to account for real features, like volcanism. A major impact and or a sudden braking of Earth's rotation would account for the breaking of the continents and their sliding over the Moho layer. The front edges of the American and Asian plates sliding mostly horizontally on the Pacific plate from east and west would account for the frictional heating that made the ring of fire. And the article shows that electrical forces are what keep those areas hot and produce earthquakes there and at the borders of all the tectonic plates. * In the first image below, red dots indicate past volcanic activity. * In the next image below, yellow dots indicate past earthquake epicenters.
Lloyd
Re: Tectonics and Earth's Interior
Aveo said: - How would you account for the presence of magma under volcanoes? - How would you account for the observed movement of the crust in various directions (ie. continental drift)? - The measurements of seismic waves also completely disallow a large hollow void (ie. hollow Earth theory) in the Earth's core, don't they?
* The paper says the magma is heated by electrical forces. But I mentioned in my immediately preceding post that the continents broke apart and slid over the Moho layer, and friction built up great heat at the leading edges of the American and Asian continental plates. Electrical forces appear to keep the ring of fire and other lines of fire hot. * Solar flares sometimes cause the Earth's rotation to slow down slightly before speeding back up to normal speed. Cardona thinks Saturn's flares in the Saturn Age slowed down Earth's rotation suddenly and almost completely, which caused the Earth's crust to slide over the Moho layer. A major impact could also have split the continents apart from the supercontinent at the same time. * Seismic waves aren't directly detected on opposite sides of the Earth from where explosions or earthquake epicenters occur. Conventional scientists assume it's because the Earth's core is solid nickel-iron. But it could also or maybe more likely be due to a hollow center.
Doureios
Re: Tectonics and Earth's Interior
Tassos is a Greek geologist and he is one of the main supporters of the Expanding Earth Hypothesis (EEH).
In this paper he suggests an electric mechanism for the generation of the new mass needed by the EEH model (IMHO a very realistic model). This mass creation process connects nicely with the flow of electrons from the ionosphere observed before earthquakes.
I will provide you with some more links and presentations about the EEH and Tassos when i will be on my pc.
Lloyd, I'm confused. How are your continental plates sliding over oceanic plates different from "subduction" — seem like descriptions of each other to me? In other words, you say subduction is impossible, then go on to explain a sliding over process that is nearly the definition of subduction for me. Do others share my confusion here?
Lloyd
Re: Tectonics and Earth's Interior
* Subduction is largely vertical. Sliding is primarily horizontal.
Lloyd
Re: Tectonics and Earth's Interior
Questions Doureios, here are 7 questions about Tassos' theories. I hope you can help explain. Thanks for trying.
Q1: If earthquakes and volcanoes are produced by Earth's core expansion and electrical forces, why do they occur only in certain locations, like the ring of fire and along tectonic plate boundaries?
Q2: How do free electrons cause microcracks to form in rock?
Q3: Does ExM, excess mass, form only in planetary cores? If so, why and how?
Q4: Continents are said not to move like rafts on a conveyor belt, but, if Earth's rotation suddenly stopped, why wouldn't the crust slide over the mantle, such as at the Moho layer? Isn't the Moho layer plasma?
Q5: How certain is it that the continents have roots and what would be the difference between rock on opposite sides of the root surfaces? How would roots form?
Q6: Why would the continents have more iron than do the ocean floors? What if the ocean floors and continents are much younger than conventional science claims?
Q7: What if Earth's crust and that of Mars and many moons were formed from detritus from Saturn flares?
nick c
Re: Tectonics and Earth's Interior
This thread is a combination of the following threads:
Lloyd wrote: Subduction is largely vertical. Sliding is primarily horizontal.
(my highlighting)
"Largely" and "primarily" indicate the possibility of an overlap of concept here. I'm curious if other detractors of subduction agree with your definition? If so, then I have been arguing in vain for all these pages [mostly on the expanding earth thread], because it matters not to me how much vertical or horizontal is involved in the concept. If "horizontal sliding over/under" is the agreed upon plate movement, then I have some basic questions about mountain formation in this view. If "vertical", then I still plead compression zone with or without the standard "subduction."
Lloyd
Re: Earth - tectonics and geology
I wrote: Subduction is largely vertical. Sliding is primarily horizontal.
Webo replied: "Largely" and "primarily" indicate the possibility of an overlap of concept here. I'm curious if other detractors of subduction agree with your definition? If so, then I have been arguing in vain for all these pages [mostly on the expanding earth thread], because it matters not to me how much vertical or horizontal is involved in the concept. If "horizontal sliding over/under" is the agreed upon plate movement, then I have some basic questions about mountain formation in this view. If "vertical", then I still plead compression zone with or without the standard "subduction."
* My understanding of tectonics comes mostly from Cardona [at http://thunderbolts.info/forum/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=10&am~], Shock Dynamics [at http://newgeology.us] and Tassos material [at http://michaelnetzer.com/gu/index.php?option=com_content&am~, http://www.scientificexploration.org/journal/jse_19_1_tasso~ etc]. They may not all be compatible, but so far they seem to be sufficiently so. * Shock Dynamics seems to explain best how the sliding occurred and it suggests that an impact initiated the supercontinent breakup and the sliding of the pieces over the Moho layer. * Cardona adds that sudden braking of Earth's rotation during Saturn flares could also have initiated sliding. * The sliding would have been largely horizontal, but the sliding pieces could have encountered slopes, like the Pacific Ocean ridge, that they may have slid over with some slight vertical motion, but still mostly horizontal. * Cardona said the Earth would have been heated up during Saturn flares, due to falling detritus, including burning hydrocarbons, and due to friction of sliding continents. * Shock Dynamics said friction was almost zero during most of the sliding, but friction would have been highest at the beginning of the sliding, when the impact was overcoming continental inertia, and at the end of the sliding, as the continents slowed down below a critical level, at which friction would have increased rapidly until the continental movement halted. Those points were on the leading and trailing edges of the continents, where mountains built up, with the highest ones building up at the leading edges as continents slowed down, such as the Rockies and Andes. * So the Pacific Ring of Fire is the area where the continents built up lots of friction and heat that has still not entirely cooled down to ambient temperature, so volcanoes and earthquakes still occur there. * The seafloor that the continents were sliding over would resemble subduction on the leading edges of those continents, but the mechanism is considerably different. I'll just quote the site to try to explain this.
The giant meteorite explodes, penetrating the continental crust. ... The force pushes up low mountains, and the landmass slides away like a ship on water, fluidizing the contact layer. Behind the landmass, a surface layer of oceanic crust is melting and cooling to form the mid-ocean spreading ridge with transform faults, pulled open by the landmass.
When the leading edge loses enough energy, the contact layer at the leading edge solidifies. The momentum of the landmass carries it forward like a car hitting a wall, piling up high mountains. The formerly fluidized contact layer in front (gray line) is a Benioff zone, called subduction zones in Plate Tectonics.
* The low mountains on the left would be the Appalachians and the high ones on the right the Rockies, where the subduction-like area exists.
MattEU
Underground River Amazon and subsurface river currents
Underground River Amazon has been 'discovered' flowing as a subsurface river below the normal River Amazon. The Underground River Amazon is much wider than the surface River Amazon and, some scientists suggest, the lower section of the Underground River Amazon is made up of salt water.
Underground River Amazon - Rio Hamza
This is the suggested creation of the subsurface River Amazon
formation of the subsurface River Amazon
What is interesting is the potential of the potential salt water flowing in the Underground River Amazon. Is this how all the water that forms the Underground River Amazon is collected? Does some or a lot of it come from within the earth itself and not reliant on the surface River Amazon? Especially the salty water.
The thing is that the 'flowing' of the subsurface River Amazon is slower than glaciers. One scientists speaking to the BBC got rather upset about the Underground River Amazon being called a river at all.
So if its not a river then what is it? Could it be a current? A water Telluric Current?
So perhaps it is not a river in the sense they think it is, could it be part of the earths electrical circuit? Does the surface River Amazon flow along its path because the subsurface River Amazon was already flowing that way? Could this be the same for other surface larger rivers or is it just unique to the River Amazon?
Water is not meant to be found deep beneath the earths surface where rock should only be, yet it is found there in amazing quantities. The 2 deepest super deep boreholes both found unexpected amounts of water very deep down. Some of it was also salt water.
It would seem that the whole earth has layers and grids in each section, from the atmosphere to the land to the seas and underground. Which controls which? Does the upper control the lower or the lower control the upper? Is the sun in charge of our Electric Solar system or are the planets in control of the sun?
And if you wanted to design an Electrical Planet in an Electric Universe is there a better design than Planet Earth with all its salty water in the oceans, animals and even now it appears deep inside the earth creating underground circuits?
Re: Underground River Amazon and subsurface river currents
Woah! This is cool, Matt! Thanks for posting this!
This will be a very interesting little story to follow and watch develop, I think.
ancientd
Re: Underground River Amazon and subsurface river currents
Yes Olly the river Murray apparently has two layers under it in what are described as ancestral rivers with aquefors. I suspect they in fact are the telluric currents . Other telluric currents I believe create gold veins whic are invariable ended with uranium veins . In other words transmutation of elemnets seems to of taken place .
MattEU
Re: Underground River Amazon and subsurface river currents
Thats great to know Frank, thanks.
One of the things i have found and noticed is that the larger enclosed seas in europe like the black sea and the Mediterranean Sea have 2 layers of water varying in salinity but especially at the mouths. These 2 layers also especially at the mouths, very strangely, normally flow in the opposite direction.
If only it was an Electric Universe we lived in then you would be able to describe these as something like a double layer, a capacitor, a circuit etc.
Another puzzle that would perhaps show that surface rivers are in fact reliant on the subsurface river or perhaps telluric currents or electric earth is the mighty River Thames in England. The River Thames has supposedly been around for 100,000s of years and its course has changed so much its amazing. How has the river changed course so much yet kept flowing (if you believe the dates they suggest)?
Perhaps if the surface river is not the actual deciding factor of the rivers course this may explain it. Its sudden changes in courses over the years could reflect the great changes and catastrophes that have effected the earth. Each time the earth undergoes a sudden and dramatic change the electric circuits in the earth change to reflect this, we get a new climate and new river courses?
This could also explain all those ancient mighty rivers that were written about that have gone missing or dried up, much to the puzzlement of geologists.
MattEU
Re: Underground River Amazon and subsurface river currents
ancientd wrote: Yes Olly the river Murray apparently has two layers under it in what are described as ancestral rivers with aquefors. I suspect they in fact are the telluric currents . Other telluric currents I believe create gold veins whic are invariable ended with uranium veins . In other words transmutation of elemnets seems to of taken place .
I think you have mentioned it before or it was in one of your videos that the Aboriginals have tales of snake spirits flowing through the land and that is how the rivers were created? So if there are telluric currents or natural circuits underground then the discharge event or electromagnetic event or whatever they were would follow that.
